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 Post subject: Source for heatsinks
PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 1:12 pm 
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Something that's been on my mind for the past .. 20 years or so, good DIL/DIP heatsinks for the SID and VIC-II chips. Perhaps something that is becoming more and more scarse, i don't know. But does anyone know a good source for these things (except for DYI) ?


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 Post subject: Re: Source for heatsinks
PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2009 11:47 am 
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Digi-Key still has heatsinks for DIPs in 14, 16, 24, and 40 pin configurations. While they may not be an exact match, they should be close enough. I have not tried these on the C64 chips so don't take this as an endorsement of product. Also, I haven't measured the VIC-II and SID chips, but I am making the assumption that they use standard DIP sizes. If that is the case, the heatsinks below should work.

40-pin heatsink for the VIC-II:

http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSea ... e=HS274-ND

The SID chip is a 28-pin chip, but the 24-pin heatsink should work fine for it:

http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSea ... e=HS273-ND

Both of these require thermal tape or thermal adhesive paste to adhere them to the chips. There may also be some clip type heatsinks there, but I didn't check for those.


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 Post subject: Re: Source for heatsinks
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 5:12 pm 
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Nice! Thanks for the check up :)

Would anyone be interested in buying? Figured a big order would bring the price down...


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 Post subject: Re: Source for heatsinks
PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 7:19 pm 
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Yes, I might be interested in getting some (disclaimer: this is not an order). I wonder how well these function, as many of the traditional DIP chips are in plastic casings, thermal flow from the chip's interior is far from optimal... I'm sure they would help, though, with especially the SID chip and perhaps VIC too.

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 Post subject: Re: Source for heatsinks
PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 9:07 pm 
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You're right, the DIPs are not designed for heatsinks like this, but one of the jobs of the casing of any chip that generates a lot of heat is to dissipate that heat. I would imagine using some thermal paste with adhesive qualities or thermal tape would be sufficient to make the heat sink do it's thing.

The main consideration here is what the intention is. If you're trying too overdrive the chip by making it draw more current than it's designed to, you're probably not going to get very far even with a heat sink. If you're just trying to extend the life of the chip by improving it's heat flow, then you're going to see some good benefits from this, assuming you have good airflow in the system.

For instance, it's important to understand that merely adding a heatsink on top of a SID chip in an unmodified C64 *could* change airflow within the system and actually cause more harm than good. I doubt it, but it's worth checking into.

Another thing to consider is that clip-type heatsinks for DIPs have metal on both the top and bottom of the chip that act as the clip to hold the heatsink in place. They're usually spring loaded to add some tension. If you could add some thermal paste in there, it might make a good heatsink giving a cooling path to both sides of the chip. However, clip type heatsinks are usually very thin and aren't as good as other types. That's why I didn't bother looking them up. But they may be a good fit here. It would take some time to test and research that.


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 Post subject: Re: Source for heatsinks
PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 10:42 pm 
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eightbits wrote:
You're right, the DIPs are not designed for heatsinks like this, but one of the jobs of the casing of any chip that generates a lot of heat is to dissipate that heat.

Right. But most MOS chips don't get very hot? It escaped me at the time, but I do remember my C128 having some white smudge on top of the chips and the RF shield sporting flaps that rested on top of that. Later I read that this was supposed to conduct heat away from the chips into the shield, which was made of rather thin aluminium... I never felt any heat from the metal cover, so I don't think this worked very well, though. :D

Testing some heatsinks might be interesting indeed. And as you say, they would in the best case scenario remove heat from the chip faster, but it will still end up in the surrounding air. So to support the heat sinks you suggest people add a fan to their C64s? :) I wonder how much airflow there really is, to begin with, inside the case of a C64. :o Most of the heat of my C128 just rises through the top of the case that gets mildly warm.

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 Post subject: Re: Source for heatsinks
PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 12:37 am 
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Fans are not necessarily the way to go. The C64C has air vents on the top rear of the case. The older breadbox C64 does not. Placement of the SID within the case may dictate whether these vents will have much of an affect. For C64Cs I'd just try it if the heat sink fits in the lower profile case. In the C64 breadbox, I'd try it, but my first step before adding fan would be to use a Dremel to cut air slots in the grooves.

Fans could be a good method, especially if all of your ports are in use as they will restrict some airflow in and out of the computer. There are fans small enough to fit in the side of the case and if you can get one or two in the right places, you could get some good airflow. But then again you may get more dust build up that could cause other issues. The only real way to know is to test it, but since many C64s are still running and many have run for years on end with pretty continuous use, it's probably not a real big deal.

So Rave, what's the purpose of the heat sinks? We're dying to know!


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 Post subject: Re: Source for heatsinks
PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 3:19 pm 
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I have some VICII chips (plastic) which after some time, approximately 30-60 minutes, started to show pixel bugs and then eventually fail completely.
I stuffed a small aluminum heatsink on each of them, using some cheap tape, and the problem went away.

Attachment:
File comment: Heat sinked C64
tn_IMG_9364_jpg.jpg [35.17 KiB]
Downloaded 56 times


As you can see, I heatsinked the CPU and SID too, as a preventive measure, as they were actually equally hot.

I got bought them on eBay years ago.


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 Post subject: Re: Source for heatsinks
PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 11:43 am 
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eightbits wrote:
The C64C has air vents on the top rear of the case. The older breadbox C64 does not.

Yes it does; at least the three I have do. I've even placed a small 5V fan under the vents to help cooling in the C64 I currently use, along with clip type heatsinks (with heat sink paste) on the SID, VIC-II, and PLA chips, which are the ones that get hot - the PLA especially has a habit of dying the heat death.


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 Post subject: Re: Source for heatsinks
PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 5:04 pm 
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Yes the old breadbox has air vents too, although they are tighter and fewer than on the C64-c.

@8bits: Well my thought was merely how to preserve/prolong the operation of the guts in our commies. Heat will eventually produce smoke, and smoking is bad for the health! =)

@Devia: Those heat sinks look really neat. Where did u get them?


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 Post subject: Re: Source for heatsinks
PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 5:29 pm 
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Yes, you're right the breadbox does have vents. As RaveGuru says, they aren't as prevalent. Regardless, after 25 years, you'd think I would have noticed those before. Maybe I did and I'm just getting senile . . .


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 Post subject: Re: Source for heatsinks
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 12:01 pm 
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I also use heatshinks. I get them for free at a garbage dump. I go in once a month and get the heatsinks from dumped PC. Then I cut them a bit and fit them on the hottest Commodore ICs. I don't want to put any fans, I love the C64s compared to PCs because they are so silent.

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